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165,442 members
198 posts
  • gtcode
    Contributor - Level 2
    2019-07-29
    Ok, after returning our DN9630 to get a used X32 Core, we finally have the components we need to cover all scenarios. Scenario 1: M32 AES50-A <-> DL32 AES50-A X32 Core AES50-A <-> DL32 AES50-B M32 sync is internal X32 Core sync is AES50-A Scenario 1, the AES50 syncs are both green on the DL32. Sync on the DL32 was green in this case. Audio seemed to work ok. Outputs should default in this case to the M32 since it's on AES50-A (that's my understanding?). Scenario 2: M32 is powered down, DL32 is still on X32 Core AES50-A <-> DL32 AES50-B In this case, we were unable to get the DL32 AES50-B to sync green. Question: Will Scenario 2 work? We want to leave the M32 powered off, and be able to use the X32 Core AES50-A to the DL32 AES50-B.
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    0 250
    • gtcode
      Paul_Vannatto


      @gtcode wrote:

      Question: Will Scenario 2 work? We want to leave the M32 powered off, and be able to use the X32 Core AES50-A to the DL32 AES50-B.



      No it will not work. The DL32 can only receive the wordclock from the AES50 A port. So if you turn off the M32 (with sync as internal - thus master clock), you will have to connect the X32 Core to the DL32 AES50 A port and turn on the sync (on X32 Core) to internal. Just remember that when you want scenario to switch it back (AES50 B and sync to AES50 A).


       


      If you don't want to hassle with changing sync and ports, a better way to set this up would be:


      M32 [B] <-> [A] X32 Core [B] <-> [A] DL32


      Make the X32 Core master clock (sync = Internal) and M32 as slave (sync = AES50 B)


      X32 Core Routing, AES50-a screen (DL32 inputs to M32)


      * Outputs 1-8 -> AES50 B1-8


      * Outputs 9-16 -> AES50 B9-16


      * Outputs 17-24 -> AES50 B17-24


      * Outputs 25-32 -> AES50 B25-32


      X32 Core Routing, AES50-b screen (M32 outputs to DL32 outputs)


      * Outputs 1-8 -> AES50 A1-8


      * Outputs 9-16 -> AES50 A9-16


       


      For scenario 2, if you want X32 Core outputs to go to the DL32, you will probably want to change the Routing, AES50-b screen to:


      * Outputs 1-8 -> Out 1-8


      * Outputs 9-16 -> Out 9-16


       

      • July 29, 2019
    • gtcode
      gtcode

      Thanks Paul.  Would the proposed second setup introduce additional latency to the M32 since the audio is ostensibly now passing through the X32 Core?

      • July 29, 2019
    • gtcode
      Paul_Vannatto


      @gtcode wrote:


      Would the proposed second setup introduce additional latency to the M32 since the audio is ostensibly now passing through the X32 Core?





      If I remember correctly the AES50 latency is 0.9ms. So if you are traveling the speed of light, I guess that would be significant. 


       

      • July 29, 2019
    • gtcode
      gtcode

      I wonder exactly how they would add up.  Maybe it's 0.9ms per stage and side, so M32->X32Core->DL32->X32Core->M32 might introduce 4 * 0.9ms = 3.6ms round trip.

      • July 29, 2019
    • gtcode
      Paul_Vannatto

      Well all I can say is that of all of the many users I've helped (over the 6+ years) with similar scenarios (console <> console <> stagebox <> stagebox), I've yet to hear from one that complained about latency issues.

      • July 29, 2019
  • JAB
    Contributor - Level 3
    2020-03-28

    I'm having trouble connecting the app. I've downloaded and added ip address with no luck connecting.

    0 123
    • JAB
      RexBeckett

      @JAB 


      We may be able to help if you tell us which console you have and what app you are using.

      • March 28, 2020
    • JAB
      JAB

      hello Again.

      • March 28, 2020
    • JAB
      GaryHiggins

      @JAB 


      What firmware for the M32? You may need to update the firmware to work with the latest M32-Edit version. Also check your network settings, they may have been reset during any update process.


       


      Also are you using a router or direct connecton from computer to mixer?

      • March 28, 2020
    • JAB
      JAB

      Thanks for your help Gary. I did get the edit software working. Just wondering if you had any thoughts The board saying live instead of USB

      • March 28, 2020
  • JRita
    Contributor - Level 1
    2020-04-06

    I spend all day testing the mixer Dynamic settings to emulate transient responses of particular microphones, it works to a point as a transient emulator, and can be usefull.
    EQ lines of particular microphones are very easy to transpose.
    I used impulses and pink noise to get an accurate mic image, next I tested the best settings I could achieve with the Gate, Comp, Low Cut and EQ, and the result is very interesting and similar to the original mic, some better, others worse.
    I could achieve better results by using a transient designer on the FX section, but I don't want to use an FX slot for this purpose, to have the freedom to mix with all effects available, and without limits for channel use to mic modeling load.

    Pros:
    It is easy to store and very quick and easy to load Mic Model settings, even from a USB pen.
    It provides interesting EQ and Dynamic settings from popular mics
    Low Cut can be adjusted to work as the real mic
    It is possible to load on diferent channels the same profile of an expensive mic
    By reversing the gain settings of EQ bands it is possible to flatten the original mic source, for example by pluging a SM57, then loading a SM57 profile, next reversing the EQ curve it is possible (to a point) to get a flat signal from the source.
    It can be usefull for decisions of what mic to purchase by experimenting with different instruments, vocals etc.

    Problems:
    It uses channel dynamics and EQ section; but it can be changed anyway, or use FX slots for additional EQ or Dynamics.
    Proximity effect can be adjusted as the real mic behaviour but it takes an EQ band, reducing mic EQ resolution, of course proximity effect will never work real time as a mic.
    Polar patterns can be added but will never emulate room, ambient reflections, unless reverb is added.
    It can duplicate frequencies of some mics, by pluging in an D112, and using the D112 profile the mic characteristics will double.
    To work at best, the sound source must be captured as neutral as possible.

    I am working of some rare RCA mics, when I finish them I will put the profiles available for download.

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    • JRita
      RexBeckett

      @JRita 


      Hello José, welcome to the community.


       


      That's an interesting project. I shall look forward to seeing your finished profiles. I am reminded, though, of a saying from the world of signal processing: There are no adjustments that can make a donkey perform like a race-horse. 

      • April 6, 2020
    • JRita
      JRita

      I've finished 3 models for testing.
      Two classic mics: RCA 44, AKG C12; and the common Shure SM57.


      I'm very happy with the results, after extensive testing, they sounded not exactly the same, but very close and definitly have the same frequency spectrum.
      The transient response is very difficult to emulate, and it is very far from the original, but it is as close as I could get, and it certainly defines more character and realism to the profiles.


      How to use:
      Download the Zip, extract it to a USB pen.
      You should have a Microphone folder with 3 profiles inside.
      Plug the USB pen to your X32/M32
      Press Library, Utility, USB Drive Import, select (Microphones) Folder, Press All, Import; profiles are now loaded.
      (CAUTION It will erase your own Library profiles)


      How it works:
      Press Library, you should see the 3 profiles on the channel tab.
      Press SELect on the channel you want to load the mic profile, and press Load Preset. You can load to various channels very fast by pressing Sel and then Load.
      VERY IMPORTANT - Adjust you signal level input to -18dB for optimal performance.
      Low Cut - Simulates the original mic Low Cut switch, if it is not present it wont do anything.
      Gate & Comp simulate the mic transient response, you can turn it off or adjust it to you taste.
      EQ - Press LOW and adjust the LOW GAIN to simulate the Proximity Effect, it reacts as the real mic, default is as far as possible with no proximity effect. The rest of the EQ settings simulate the mic frequency response.


      Trick - To neutralize the mic frequencies of a real mic plugged in in order to get an aproximate flat response, reverse the image of EQ settings.(Change + to - and vice versa of every setting). You will have to choose the same profile of the mic your connecting.

      ANOTHER TRICK -  try to use this as a master stereo EQ, very nice results as if the whole image is captured by a stereo pair.

      Microphones Test.zip
      • April 8, 2020
  • Mentor
    Contributor - Level 1
    2019-11-18

     

    I am having a issue when I try to rout audio between Midas M32R and Tesira Server. All the inputs look to be direct outputs, and I dont have any fader control on the input.

     

     

    0 109
    • Mentor
      RexBeckett

      @Mentor 


      Hello Mentor, welcome to the forum.


       


      When you are setting routing on the Routing -> Card Output page, the Local and AES signal will be the direct inputs before any channel processing. If you want to use signals from other signal taps, you should Stage them on the Output 1-16, Ultranet or Aux Out tabs.


       


      If you upgade to firmware V4.0, you can also use the new User Out routing to manage the individual signals instead of being tied to blocks of eight.


       


      If you attach your scene file (see Choose File button below), and tell us what channels/taps you want routed to the card outputs, we could give you more specific help. Do tell us which firmware version you are using.

      • November 18, 2019
  • one2one
    Contributor - Level 1
    2020-02-04

    Hey fellow tech heads i need some help. Recently purchased a Midas DP48 and am trying to connect it to the Midas Pro 1. any ideas on how to do it. thanks in advance

    0 77
    • one2one
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi James @one2one 


      Welcome to the forum. You should be able to connect the DP48 to one of the AES50 ports of the Pro 1. Since the Pro 1 has a 96Khz clock rate, that would mean that the DP48 would only be able to access 24 channels instead of the 48 channels (at 44/48Khz clock rate).


       


      There is no DP48 support on the Pro 1 for group names and assignments, like on the M32. You will need to do that on the DP48 itself. To create the group names, you will need to create a file called names.csv. In it should be one line of comma delimited names, for example


      Gtr1Vox,Gtr2Vox,DrumVox,None,Gtr1,Gtr2,Bass,None,KickIn,DrumMix,None,TB


      and save that file in the DP48 folder in the SD card. Finally insert the SD card into the DP48 and go to the Setup, Group Names to load them in.


       


       

      • February 3, 2020
    • one2one
      one2one

      hello again, followed your steps but still getting nothing on the DP48. currently though the "in" symbol on the DP48 is switching between red and green and still cant get any audio out of it. is that a DP48 problem or a Pro1 problem. 


      thanks in advance

      • February 6, 2020
  • PatrickGMaillot
    Valued Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-19
    Preparing new features for X32Automate programs: The X32 "GO" button can be used to launch different automation files (audio alone, audio+automation, etc.) to manage Musicals, Theater plays, shows, etc. First demo at https://youtu.be/bldx4bSH8DU More information at http://x32ram.com
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  • soundpressure
    Contributor - Level 1
    2020-02-21

    How to use M32 Sine Wave funtion, I can do the system tuning with RTA. Just curious if same could be done with sine wave.

    0 55
    • soundpressure
      RexBeckett

      @soundpressure 


      Hello Ken, welcome to the community.


       


      You could use a succession of sine wave signals at 1/3rd octave frequency intervals to emulate a frequency sweep. In some ways this is better than using pink noise to evaluate system response but it would take a lot longer. It can be quite useful for checking how well crossover filters in active monitors and subs work together.

      • February 21, 2020
  • allesbl
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-02-10

    Hi,

    I don't know if this is the right place to report bugs, but I'll place my post here. Hopefully it will be read by someone responsible for MR18 maintenance and support.

    One month ago I bought MR18 mixer and updated the firmware to latest 1.17 version. Then during tests I found out that the unit can produce a very loud squeal on Main LR output and any Bus 1-6 output after powering it up. As I found later, it was already mentioned in this forum here:

    https://community.musictribe.com/t5/Recording/MR18-Power-On-Start-Up-Noise/td-p/185693

    and here:

    https://community.musictribe.com/t5/Recording/Loud-squeal-after-powering-up-MR18/td-p/180023

    The squeal sound from my MR18 sounds exactly the same as the one posted by Jay Haynes in the first thread.

    This was posted in 2017 and I wonder it is not fixed yet, because the mixer can become really dangerous when power is unexpectedly interrupted and then restored - not only blasting the PA loudspeakers at Main LR, but with in-ears connected to Bus 1-6 it may cause serious hearing damage!!!

    Sorry, but such behaviour of a professional, even Midas-branded product is simply unacceptable, regardless as much as the product is low-priced. Competitor products such as Mackie DL32R don't do this - on power up and after an initial silent period it simply starts to pass audio with last settings applied. No glitches,
    no pops.

    Please, don't state now "you should turn on the mixer first and speakers last". Although this is of course fully true, in a real life with real fallible people it cannot be always fulfilled under all circumstances. An unexpected short power dropout with MR18 is enough to cause big problems, e.g. someone pulls out by mistake the power cord from the socket and then puts it back again.

    Workaround with "Mute at power on" setup option is insufficient. It relies on a user action and therefore is not always guaranteed, despite the sentence in manual "Engage the 'Mute at Power On' to avoid pops during start up." Not to mention, there is no hint of how loud the MR18 "pops" can be. Under "pops" I understand loud but very short signal bursts which can be unpleasant, but mostly not destructive. However, the mixer produces maybe 0.5 sec long squeal signal with wide spectrum and full scale amplitude which totally overdrives anything connected to the outputs.
    Often it could be also required that the device resumes operation after power cycling with last settings applied and without any user intervention. In this case "Mute at power on" option cannot be used.

    Nevertheless, not only to complain, but to be a bit constructive too - with my MR18 I could observe following behaviour:

    - the squeal sound comes from any input channel (1-16, line 17-18) to any Bus 1-6 and/or Main LR output when channel bus sends and/or channel fader are turned up. Bus and main masters are set permanently to 0dB. Squeal to buses comes from all possible tap point selections.

    - the squeal sound comes only from input channels which have a physical input patched. If the channel is not patched (OFF in the routing table) or USB is selected as source, then the squeal sound doesn't appear. Also effect returns don't produce squeal sound, supposed effect sends on all inputs are all the way turned down.

    - the squeal sound doesn't come out of Phones output. There seems to be some automatic muting during power up - phones output is quiet until the squeal on main/bus outputs fades away and then starts to play normally.

    So this would definitely point to an issue with A/D converters / preamps during initialization.

    Such kind of issue can be for sure fixed by a firmware update. If the root cause cannot be solved easily, please apply to all outputs at least automatic muting immediately on boot up, as a first step of the initialization sequence, and automatic unmuting just only after the initialization has been completed and the squeal already faded away. Automatic unmute would take place conditionally depending on the "Mute at power on" setting: TRUE = leave outputs muted until user intervention (same as now), FALSE = unmute automatically after squeal is gone.
    Or maybe a different approach: temporarily reset the routing table at startup so that all channels are not patched and restore it only just after the A/D and preamps have settled properly.
    Adding such relatively simple functionality to next firmware update may well improve the user experience of this - so far working good - product.

    Many thanks in advance!

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    • allesbl
      GaryHiggins

      @allesbl In setup, audio/midi "mute output at power cycle" needs to have a check mark in the box.


      z.PNG.

      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Ales @allesbl 


      Welcome to the forum. I can assure you that this "squeal" is not due to a bug in the firmware, or it would be happening to many of us users. As far as I remember, those 2 threads were the only reports of this issue, and we were unable to replicate the problem ourselves. If you notice that in both cases, the user(s) did not provide a scene file for us to check. I would suggest that you export your scene to a file (using M-Air-Edit for PC, Mac or linux) and attach it to your next post (Choose File below). Then we can have a look and see if we can determine the source of the squeal.


       

      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      allesbl

      Hi Paul,


      thank you for welcome and your quick reaction. Enclosed you can find a .scn file with the setting which produces the squeal on my MR18. Basically, it is a factory default routing with my personal EQ, gate and compressor settings for a small band as a start point for sound check. Channel 14 has the fader and bus sends turned up which is the path for "squeal" to all outputs. If you load this scene into the mixer, wait some time to store it into inernal memory, switch the mixer off and then switch it on back again, you should get the "squeal" on all bus/main outputs during startup - providing that "mute at power on" is not set, I don't know if this is stored in the scene too. If you unpatch the channel 14 to OFF or set the source to USB, then the disturbing sound will not come at next startup. If you repeat this settings on any other input channel 1-16, 17-18, you should get the same result at next power up.


      My unit has serial number S190700210C8H. From my point of view this is definitely a bug. I discovered it randomly, because I'm used to test everything properly before real use, including such "abnormal operation" like power cycling with open loudspeakers and in-ears. Hopefully the attached file will help you to replicate the squeal sound at startup.


       

      ch14-patched-in14_squeal.scn
      • February 10, 2020
    • allesbl
      Paul_Vannatto

      Hi Ales @allesbl ,


      Thanks for the scene file. I was able to replicate the issue and that was definitely not a squeal. It was more like a synthesizer noise. To be honest, that is the very first time I've heard that come out of the MR18 (or XR18 or X32) in all the years (and many events) that I've done sound with these digital mixers. Granted the norm is to hook everything up, turn on the console, then go around and turn on all of the powered speakers (and do the opposite at the end of the event). But occasionally I do find a powered speaker already on (because someone forgot to turn it off at teardown of last event). 


       


      I do have to admit that you did indeed find a bug. But you have to understand that since no one has provided a scene file to replicate it, it was very difficult to investigate the "bug". Add to that, the  majority of issues we encounter here on the forum are user setting related. We did have a similar scenario with a user with a bizarre EQ settings (on the GEQ) on his X32. With his scene file we were able to replicate it and I sent it off to the developers - and they found the bug. 


       


      I did load one of my good known scenes over top of yours and tried it and got a similar noise. So I initialized the console, then loaded my good known scene and there was a minor pop (expected when you have the powered speaker on before turning on the console), but did not get your (weird) noise. So it is definitely a combination of settings in your scene that is producing this output.


       


      I will inform the developers of this and link your explanation and scene file for an investigation.


       

      • February 10, 2020
  • vita
    Contributor - Level 2
    2020-04-08

    Midas, can you solve the pro2 offline editor compatibility issue with catalina O.S? Please!

    I need this app very mutch, to work at home.

    I am a Portuguese soud engeneer.

    Thank you.

    0 181
    • vita
      ChaseMcKnight

      Hi @vita 

      While the Pro2 & Pro1 Offline Editors are currently not compatible with macOS Catalina, the ProX OLE is. I would suggest using it. Because of our console showfile compatibilities, you can import/export show files to/from a Pro2 using the ProX Offline Editor -- just know anything past the Pro2's input count and FX slots won't populate in the desk if exceeded in the editor. 

      • April 10, 2020
    • vita
      vita

      Tested. The proX offline editor doesn't work either!

      • April 10, 2020
    • vita
      ChaseMcKnight

      Hi @vita 

      Updating my post:
      It seems the G3.4.6rel-9 OLE for ProX isn't compatible with macOS Catalina. Until we have an update that is compatible with macOS Catalina, users should stay or roll back to macOS Mojave. 

      • April 13, 2020
    • vita
      Derric_West

      It has almost been a year since Catalina was released.  There should be compatable version by now!!!  Please update soon.

      • May 12, 2020
    • vita
      cpc1981

      Any chance of an indication when this might be made available for Catalina? Obviously not a pressing matter while the world is broken, but a rough idea/indictaion that this is being worked on would be very helpful.


      cheers

      • May 13, 2020
  • KurtHutchison
    Contributor - Level 2
    2019-11-19

    Just wanted to double check, my understanding is scene save files are compatible across the midas M32 line (including the X32).

    Hoping it's a dropt-in replacement (we only use AES-50 and very few of the back-panel connectors, nothing the M32R doesn't have).

    This would be a one-shot upgrade, so some minor loss could probably be accomodated.

    thanks.

    read more...
    0 114
    • KurtHutchison
      DaveMorrison

      @KurtHutchison 


      Yes. The are the same file format and you can move scenes from one console to another. You can even use the same apps to control them both. 


      Edit: Be aware that the full size X32 has the LR outputs on XLR 15 and 16; whereas, the M32R is 7 & 8. If your sending the mains (LR) to a stage box over AES50, they will be the same.

      • November 19, 2019
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